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 Post subject: [beta] q3chaosdm2-beta1 (dmschaos)
PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:05 am 
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BETA 2 Released - [link=http://www.burial-grounds.com/quakewars/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?8625]CLICK HERE!!![/link]

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With the renewed interest in q3 (mainly mine), I decided to pick up where I left off on this map (nearly 2 years ago, lol).

Anyway, as the filename hints too, this is a remake of Q2DM6 Lava Tomb. This is a complete brush by brush remake, not some cheap bsp - map conversion. It actually had to be done twice, because my damn scale was way off (me = noob).

Anyway, it's my first map that might actually get released, so I'm looking for some feedback. I'm so sick of looking at it that I'm sure I'm missing all kinds of stuff. This is early beta, so things like clipping, bots and the like have not been given much if any attention yet. However it's very playable.

Anyway, [link=http://www.burial-grounds.com/Q3-Q2DM6v2.pk3]linkage[/link]!

You can play it at 72.71.206.239:27961

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 6:05 am 
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I like how close this play and feels like the original map - most quake 2 maps remade for quake 3 have a weird hybrid feel that doesn't quite work.

The outdoor area needs more shadows/lighting contrast currently it has a "fullbright" look.

The part of the cave area at the rocket launcher with the lava and stepping stones could prolly do with a few more jagged pieces of rock strewn around.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 3:47 pm 
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no screens = no dl!

joking.. ill check this one out this afternoon.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 5:18 pm 
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pretty good, on the ramp that opens and splits in the middle if I go up the right side it's fine but when I go up the left side and put my shoulder to the wall I go through the wall and a funky vis problem occurs.

Try adding a blocking volume there. Also the steps outside that curve need a more earthy texture IMO.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 10:12 pm 
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Looks fun...

On the pads that go to the BFG, when you jump across them, they go down into the lava. But when you stand on them, they only go down a few feet then come back up. I dont know if this is intentional or not, but it seems like they should completely recede into the lava so a player is forced to jump across them rather quickly or not at all.

I dont like the RL placement either, I think its a little too tough to grab, especially considering that its the only one in the map.. If you had 2 RL's and this was a secondary one, it would be OK. Speaking of which, maybe you should add another one on the other side of the map, possibly replacing one of the many SG's.

There is an area where there are staggered blocks that you jump up on in sequence to reach the next level. When you jump on the 1st block, you can walk into the second block using it as a stop, and jump to the next block. Once you get to the 4th or 5th level, the blocks are far enough apart that you fall down in between them trying to use this method. This may be intentional but it doesnt seem right to have the spacing different - it can be pretty confusing. And that route is already slow and dangerous enough without that :D

Other than that, I really like the layout and flow. The dimensions are very good (I think I may have played a previous version of this a while back that was a little cramped) and the distances are comfortable.

There are a couple of semi-secret areas that are 'tucked away' behind something or in a lava pit that you wouldnt otherwise recognize. Maybe adding some sort of visual cue that there may be something down there - maybe a light or something - would be a good thing.

I agree with Rroff that the outside area feels too bright. Some more contrasty lighting would be nice.

Cool map, I may just check it out on the server later :)

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 10:51 pm 
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SS it's a remake, and this is the original placement except the lightning replaces the chain gun.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 11:31 pm 
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Rroff:
The sky texture is causing the outdoor area to be so bright. I'll be changing it to a darker texture soon. I'll also add some more jaggies by the RL! Thanks.

Keen:
I was not aware of that bug on the ramp, thanks...I'll take a look at it. As for the stairs, I'll see what I can do....athough they are supposed to be "stairs", but maybe they need to be more a part of the "earth"? I'll experiment.

StormShadow:
I'm aware of the pads at the BFG. I'm not exactly sure what's causing it, but I tried a few things with the triggers and will see what works in the next compile...it's defniitely not intentional.

The RL placement is exactly where it's supposed to be based on the original Q2 map. I'm trying to keep the map layout and item placement as close to the original as possible. Should charon have moved the RL in Q2Dm1? ;)

I was aware the blocks were not exactly placed perfectly going up to the LG, however after about 100 attempts going up those blocks, I never once fell..so I wasnt aware it was a problem. I'll look in to it.

Yah, the first version of this map was scaled improperly...I had to rescale it and completely renovate it to it's current version.

As for the "secret" areas, I kind of left them "secret" for a few reasons. First of all, I figured this being a Q2 remake, most people would know where things were...but I guess if you've never played Q2, that's a little bit of a problem. Secondly, I like secrets in maps...especially one that I NEVER knew existed until I started making this map :) I'll see what I can do to add a subtle hint to each one, but I think most will be discovered pretty easily with normal gameplay.

Again, the outdoor lighting will be reduced when I change the sky texture.

Thanks for the feedback so far, it's been helpful.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 11:45 pm 
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Well you made a couple other concessions to convert the map to q3, I thought adding another rl might not be such a farfetched idea :D But yeah, I totally understand the desire to keep the item placement the same.

Ill be happy to look at your trigger entity to see why the pads are bugged if youd like.

Server is on my fav's list, ill scan it later tonite to see if anyones around :)

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 11:59 pm 
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I tried to keep any changes cosmetic for artistc license, but if I did make any changes that might affect gameplay, lemme know.

I know the RL is a bitch, but it was in Q2 as well...so I figured it would be one of those things that you just live with and either grab another weapon or get in and out of there as fast as possible :)

You can actually run to that RL without having to jump...just an FYI...

As for the entity giving me problems with the pads at the BFG, i'll chat with you on IRC if you ever answer ;)

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 12:11 am 
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keen, I cant seem to replicate the problem you noted. Can you take a screenshot for me, showing the vis error occuring.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 12:20 am 
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hm, I guess the MH outside is a concession I made...as well as the YA near the GL that replaces the ammo pak...but I can live with those :)

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 2:59 am 
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the YA is a good replacement for the bandolier...

I couldn't reproduce the error keen was talking about however I did notice that if I really pushed up against either side as the ramp was moving the walls seemed to wobble a bit - this is a quake 3 engine issue and can't be solved by the mapper.

I actually like the RL placement - I feel it livens up the game play having to be strategic about getting it and the chance of being trapped in there - if you do place more jaggies in that area please don't put the big roof one in like the original map has as it gets in the way as you try to jump out.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 8:36 pm 
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If you jump in the lava in the blue box area you dont die. You can also see a seam between that lava brush and the next brush if you look closely (I can show a screenie if you like). Its a bit nitpicky, but its pretty easy to fix :)[br][img:width=500&height=375]../../e107_files/public/1159212994_25_FT8540_shot60.jpg[/img]

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2006 8:53 pm 
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yah, we saw that play testing. I think it's because I put a no_draw texture on the sides of the lava??? Or is it something else?

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2006 4:01 pm 
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Yeah thats probably why. I'd just delete the offending brush, and copy a working lava brush and stick it in there.. Or just delete it and extend the lava brush right next to it over the space. That way you get rid of the seam as well.

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